#jogamp @ irc.freenode.net - 20150821 05:05:30 (UTC)

20150821 05:05:30 -jogamp- Previous @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20150820050530.html
20150821 05:05:30 -jogamp- This channel is logged @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20150821050530.html
20150821 05:09:10 * badshah400 (~badshah40@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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20150821 06:12:30 <elect> hi
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20150821 07:36:31 <eclesia> hi
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20150821 08:09:26 <monsieur_max> xranby_ : what was the ubuntu phone you were using ?
20150821 08:10:46 <xranby_> monsieur_max: i have a "bq" aquaris E4.5
20150821 08:10:56 <xranby_> ubuntu edition
20150821 08:11:15 <monsieur_max> happy with it ? using it on daily basis ?
20150821 08:12:38 <xranby_> i am using it on daily basis, my last phone was a nokia n9 thus i am comparing to that
20150821 08:13:09 <xranby_> i have not figured how to run regular x11 applications on it yet, needs mir "wayland" ports of all aplications
20150821 08:13:39 <xranby_> there is no x11 compatibility layer installed by default
20150821 08:13:49 <xranby_> thus it is ubuntu under the hood
20150821 08:13:55 <xranby_> when you go down to the command line
20150821 08:15:08 <xranby_> the overall feeling is that its a new kind of mobile phone... instead of getting the feeling of having a desktop in my pocket.
20150821 08:15:25 <xranby_> i was hoping to have the desktop in my pocket feeling
20150821 08:15:43 <xranby_> on my nokia n9 i was able to run netbeans
20150821 08:15:56 <monsieur_max> ok, thanks, you answered exact what i wanted to read
20150821 08:16:31 <monsieur_max> *exactly
20150821 08:19:06 <xranby_> i can run openjdk on it.. thus i will use it to make sure jogamp run on it
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20150821 08:21:46 <gouessej> Hi
20150821 08:22:18 <gouessej> xranby: I understand your frustration
20150821 08:24:27 <monsieur_max> I have a question. Soon i'll have to start packaging things for my game. One of my question is obfuscating resources such as graphics, sound, xmls. Right now, my game is a jar containing only compiled code and the resources are in separate folders. How would you proceed to pack and protect such resources from tampering ? How would you pack everything ?
20150821 08:27:52 <gouessej> You can use ProGuard, it would be a good start
20150821 08:28:17 <gouessej> but you can't protect everything, all protections are breakable at some point
20150821 08:28:53 <gouessej> I don't think obfuscating everything is a good idea
20150821 08:28:54 <monsieur_max> well, i did not mentionned it but i already use proguard on my classes
20150821 08:29:01 <gouessej> Even Minecraft doesn't do so
20150821 08:29:44 <gouessej> sgothel: I will try to document the other formats as soon as possible
20150821 08:29:49 <monsieur_max> yes, of course, but well, it's a way to learn new things too
20150821 08:30:00 <gouessej> sgothel: at least tell what they are
20150821 09:07:54 <gouessej> sgothel: I'll put this information into the source code https://jogamp.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1042#c15
20150821 09:28:08 <xranby> monsieur_max: how about placing your resources inside your jar?
20150821 09:29:41 <monsieur_max> xranby: would it be enough ? would it make starting time longer ? i'm not really used to using jars
20150821 09:31:51 * gouessej (5ee4b442@anon) Quit (Quit: Page closed)
20150821 09:42:39 <xranby> monsieur_max: my idea was if you put all graphics, sound, xml into one jar then it owuld not be obvious how to tamper with them since they are inside a file rather than separate files
20150821 09:42:58 <xranby> monsieur_max: but yes it do take some time to unpack from a jar.. a jar is basically a zip file
20150821 09:44:23 <bruce-> what does tamper mean? is it replacing the game graphics? or is it stealing and reusing them for other purposes?
20150821 09:44:51 <xranby> or simply you do not want your users to see the end boss before they meet it
20150821 09:45:10 <bruce-> fair point too
20150821 09:45:11 <xranby> since monsieur_max is making a horror game ,, seeing something may spoil
20150821 09:45:14 <xranby> the feeling
20150821 09:45:28 <monsieur_max> that's the idea
20150821 09:45:44 <bruce-> mv data SPOILERS_AHEAD
20150821 09:46:03 <monsieur_max> also, even if everything could be cracked, it's not a reason to make things too easy ;)
20150821 09:46:06 <xranby> then you have to organize the data
20150821 09:47:02 <xranby> SPOILERS_A_HEARD/A_DARK_TUNNEL/DO_YO_WANT_TO_GO_DEEPER/BE_AFRAID/TURN_AROUND/...
20150821 09:47:36 <xranby> and suddenly you have turned your game into a puzzle
20150821 09:47:45 <monsieur_max> :) hehe
20150821 09:49:54 * xranby (~xranby@anon) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
20150821 09:52:20 <bruce-> I like it
20150821 10:27:18 * xranby (~xranby@anon) has joined #jogamp
20150821 10:59:42 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/deployment/archive/master/gluegen_885-joal_611-jogl_1425-jocl_1074/ <- and another one ..
20150821 11:01:46 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/deployment/archive/master/gluegen_885-joal_611-jogl_1425-jocl_1074/javadoc/jogl/javadoc/com/jogamp/newt/Window.html#getSupportedStateMask%28%29 <- ideas/review welcome ..
20150821 11:02:03 <sgothel> see http://jogamp.org/git/?p=jogl.git;a=commit;h=1d71a21d9d1da21c555207d30d202f724ae269f2
20150821 11:02:20 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/git/?p=jogl.git;a=blobdiff;f=src/newt/classes/com/jogamp/newt/Window.java;h=51395602cf737933573acfaefc6cbdc60e88724c;hp=7ba94d5b258c238b23ab2138851282f32954393f;hb=1d71a21d9d1da21c555207d30d202f724ae269f2;hpb=417546510a93de533562b631caa4a75feeecd793
20150821 11:02:31 <sgothel> i.e. semantics of the supported state-mask ..
20150821 11:02:53 <sgothel> since we reuse the state-[bit/mask] .. semantics might be *complicated*
20150821 11:03:26 <sgothel> i.e. some features can be achieved at native window creation, but they cannot be 'toggled'
20150821 11:03:30 <sgothel> afterwards
20150821 11:03:46 <sgothel> some features may be toggled at all times
20150821 11:04:02 <sgothel> ^^ all depending on the support-mask -> i.e. implementation
20150821 11:04:29 <sgothel> @Xerxes: http://jogamp.org/git/?p=jogl.git;a=blobdiff;f=src/newt/classes/jogamp/newt/driver/bcm/vc/iv/WindowDriver.java;h=315a41b1ff8d56a7a6d938900616ed852873de64;hp=16b0f2ee9fa4780f96a2ab5daf2f0c037b89c164;hb=1d71a21d9d1da21c555207d30d202f724ae269f2;hpb=417546510a93de533562b631caa4a75feeecd793
20150821 11:05:40 <sgothel> next step is to suppress the action toggling the feature/state when not supported, so the current state-mask reflects reality
20150821 11:12:16 <xranby> sgothel: so if i understand.. with this change only fullscreen are supported using the bcm vc iv ?
20150821 11:13:33 * xranby tries to wrap my head around it
20150821 11:13:36 <sgothel> after native creation .. yes
20150821 11:13:50 <xranby> thus you can move it but not resize it ?
20150821 11:13:58 <sgothel> i.e. before the supported mask is unknown, i.e. all bits set ..
20150821 11:14:14 <sgothel> resizeable -> RTFM :)
20150821 11:14:29 <xranby> yes it is commented out
20150821 11:14:31 <sgothel> i.e. be able to disable and toggle it :)
20150821 11:14:57 <sgothel> STATE_BIT_RESIZABLE: Window resizability can be disabled and toggled.
20150821 11:15:27 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/deployment/archive/master/gluegen_885-joal_611-jogl_1425-jocl_1074/javadoc/jogl/javadoc/com/jogamp/newt/Window.html#getSupportedStateMask%28%29
20150821 11:16:18 <xranby> sgothel: when i read the dic i see a lot of STATE_BIT when i erad the source is ee a lot of STATE_MASK
20150821 11:16:20 <xranby> doc
20150821 11:17:11 <sgothel> I ref the *BIT* here b/c they offer direct API doc .. hmm ofc its mask is supported
20150821 11:17:22 <sgothel> i.e. bit = 3, mask = 1 << 2 ..
20150821 11:17:29 <sgothel> mask = 1 << 3 .. duh!
20150821 11:17:58 <sgothel> confusing: shall fix that .. i.e. stating mask
20150821 11:18:00 <sgothel> good
20150821 12:27:02 <elect> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/08/githubs-top-coding-languages-show-open-source-is-everywhere/
20150821 13:13:07 <xranby> (13:03:04) sgothel: http://jogamp.org/deployment/archive/master/gluegen_885-joal_611-jogl_1425-jocl_1074/ <- and another one .. <-- 1196 verified WinXP work with this one
20150821 13:13:17 <sgothel> sweet
20150821 13:28:15 <xranby> sgothel: when i run com.jogamp.opengl.test.junit.jogl.demos.gl2.newt.TestGearsNEWT -time 40000 i am puzzled by the mousepointer do not change into "resize" arrots at the border of the GLWindow
20150821 13:28:18 <xranby> on WinXP
20150821 13:30:59 <xranby> tsting using
20150821 13:31:03 <xranby> java -cp jogamp-fat-test.jar com.jogamp.opengl.test.junit.jogl.demos.gl2.newt.TestGearsNEWT -time 40000
20150821 13:31:29 <sgothel> hmm
20150821 13:31:31 <xranby> i see resize arrows using x11 linux but i see no resize arrows using GDI on WinXP
20150821 13:31:33 <sgothel> can you resize?
20150821 13:31:37 <xranby> yes i can resize
20150821 13:31:52 <sgothel> toggle resize -> 'r' I guess (see that demo listener code)
20150821 13:33:03 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/git/?p=jogl.git;a=blob;f=src/test/com/jogamp/opengl/test/junit/util/NEWTDemoListener.java;h=68a983a275c600b0529f101dbb08ca26560cf74a;hb=HEAD#l92
20150821 13:33:24 <sgothel> VK_R it is :)
20150821 13:34:07 <xranby> nothing happens for me when i press R
20150821 13:34:09 <xranby> or r
20150821 13:34:15 <xranby> hmm
20150821 13:37:46 <xranby> but the explenation is that TestGearsNEWT only extend UITestCase http://jogamp.org/git/?p=jogl.git;a=blob;f=src/test/com/jogamp/opengl/test/junit/jogl/demos/gl2/newt/TestGearsNEWT.java;h=0f3011c3d4256fdc164dc4e934e8c7e7269514f6;hb=HEAD
20150821 13:37:59 <xranby> f and d work
20150821 13:42:33 <sgothel> oh
20150821 13:42:51 <sgothel> so we need a *patch* :)
20150821 13:43:13 <sgothel> all those basic tests/demos shall use that demo listener ..
20150821 13:47:28 <xranby> whall we patch UITestCase to extend it?
20150821 13:48:02 <xranby> or patch the demos to extend both?
20150821 13:58:08 <sgothel> hu ?
20150821 13:58:20 <sgothel> patch the demo to *use* the demo-listener
20150821 13:58:42 <xranby> sgothel: when should the UITestCase be used?
20150821 13:58:55 <sgothel> or .. yeah, the patch the demo's listener to extend the demo-listener :)
20150821 13:59:13 <sgothel> for all GL or UI related tests
20150821 13:59:23 <sgothel> usually all of jogl's ..
20150821 13:59:49 * gouessej (5ee4b442@anon) has joined #jogamp
20150821 13:59:52 <gouessej> Hi
20150821 13:59:57 <xranby> gouessej: hi!
20150821 14:00:02 <sgothel> hi
20150821 14:00:48 <gouessej> sgothel: I'm overcrowded, please can you suggest the JMonkeyEngine team to keep the JOGL backend in JMonkeyEngine 3.1?
20150821 14:01:07 <sgothel> I was just reading .. :)
20150821 14:01:08 <xranby> gouessej: there is a new libgdx release today... ideally we should merge this and then update the backends/gdx-backend-jogamp/pom.xml to use the new version (without-SNAPSHOT)
20150821 14:01:14 <sgothel> looks like they need a maintainer .. hmm
20150821 14:01:26 <gouessej> xranby: I updated the stuff a few days ago
20150821 14:01:37 <monsieur_max> https://twitter.com/dave1010/status/613601365529657344
20150821 14:02:10 <gouessej> sgothel: What do you mean? Have I missed anything? I can maintain this backend but I can't spend my lifetime on their forum
20150821 14:02:40 <sgothel> hehe
20150821 14:02:53 <sgothel> jmasing (sic?) mentioned it on our forum
20150821 14:03:03 <sgothel> why don't they write to our forum for questions?
20150821 14:03:31 <sgothel> yup, same thing here Julien ..
20150821 14:03:47 <gouessej> sgothel: I asked them to do so
20150821 14:03:54 <sgothel> good
20150821 14:04:24 <gouessej> sgothel: http://hub.jmonkeyengine.org/t/jogl-support-jogl2-that-is/20891/306
20150821 14:04:36 <xranby> gouessej: i can do this version sync with their new release version
20150821 14:04:41 <xranby> (libgdx)
20150821 14:05:06 <sgothel> so libgdx is not willing to maintain this backend?
20150821 14:05:11 <gouessej> xranby: Ok. Do you need some help?
20150821 14:05:22 <sgothel> thought they will 'take over' this task at one point .. hmm
20150821 14:05:34 <sgothel> i.e. that is the whole idea .. isn't it?
20150821 14:05:41 <xranby> sgothel: that is the idea..
20150821 14:05:48 <sgothel> (we help kick-off .. then they go ahead ..)
20150821 14:06:20 <gouessej> sgothel: They won't. I thought that it was the whole idea almost ten years ago. Now I know what the whole idea is.
20150821 14:07:03 <sgothel> :)
20150821 14:08:33 <gouessej> xranby: the JogAmp test module is still a bit broken, the rest should work
20150821 14:08:50 <gouessej> JogAmp LibGDX tests module of course
20150821 14:11:42 <sgothel> *KUDOS* to Julien and Xerxes helping downstream projects!
20150821 14:15:43 <gouessej> sgothel: Thanks... and my main project is more or less stalling. I'd like some of them to go ahead.
20150821 14:16:39 <sgothel> well .. to focus also means to say no sometimes.
20150821 14:26:39 <gouessej> sgothel: JMonkeyEngine is the most famous 3D engine written in Java. I just like to delegate a bit some work. Hopefully, Xerxes helps me with LibGDX and Harvey has done a great job with Java3D.
20150821 14:26:48 <xranby> gouessej: there is some compile errors of the jogamp backend when used in combination with libgdx 1.6.5 (you branch build the jogamp backend against 1.6.3-SNAPSHOT)
20150821 14:27:04 <xranby> thus maven downloads one old libgdx release
20150821 14:27:15 <xranby> and try compile the jogamp backend against that
20150821 14:27:33 <gouessej> xranby: Don't hesitate to make a pull request and I'll fix the rest if necessary
20150821 14:30:22 <xranby> gouessej: https://github.com/gouessej/libgdx/pull/7
20150821 14:32:07 <xranby> happy to see that libgdx now include arm natives!
20150821 14:32:39 <xranby> that was the hard part before, that you had to compile your own armhf libgdx natives
20150821 14:36:30 <gouessej> xranby: I'll fix the rest at home soon, thanks
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20150821 14:37:46 <elect> monsieur_max, I need that
20150821 14:38:42 <xranby> gouessej: the compile issues seen was caused by not having add jogamp's test maven added to maven repositorys ..
20150821 14:39:09 <xranby> we may add it to our pom.xml
20150821 14:52:10 <elect> [pedantic] I'd like to point that some of these problems are some of the consequences of a *too small* community, the load work is too much, future devs are *vital* for jogl[/pedantic]
20150821 14:53:11 * elect is waiting for lapidation
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20150821 16:02:57 <elect> btw sgothel, I think you should write a wiki page explaining why jogl is better than lwjgl
20150821 16:03:40 <elect> advantages and disavantages of jogl over lwjgl
20150821 16:05:06 <sgothel> http://forum.jogamp.org/Why-does-JOGL-use-Instances-of-GLContext-GL-instead-of-exposing-a-Static-API-td4034144.html
20150821 16:05:23 <sgothel> well, I don't want to do a review, since I am one of the principal authors
20150821 16:06:06 <elect> but you are one of the few who deeply understand all the implications/pro and vs
20150821 16:06:09 <sgothel> however - I want to write (accumulate) some *big points* which are currently spread out ..
20150821 16:06:15 <elect> just expose the facts
20150821 16:06:19 <sgothel> hence I write about benefits ..
20150821 16:06:35 <sgothel> and yes, will do a summary in wiki for example, good point - thank you
20150821 16:06:44 <elect> I wish I could have read a page like that when I began with opengl & java
20150821 16:07:26 <sgothel> hmm ... so I shall make a bug report for this and collect all the source pieces of info .. at least first
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20150821 19:55:07 <gouessej> elect: You're right but anyway, there are a few people on the Earth able to port Java 3D to JOGL 2 in 4 hours :D
20150821 19:55:22 <gouessej> xranby: I thought I had added it into the Gradle script
20150821 19:56:13 <gouessej> xranby: it's in build.gradle
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20150821 20:13:20 <gouessej> xranby: the build seems to work
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20150821 20:21:47 <xranby_> gouessej why did you change JoglApplicationConfiguration to be abstract ? i wanted to instansiate this class in my libgdx demos
20150821 20:24:02 <xranby_> aha i see you have made it abstract in order to split it into -> JoglNewtApplicationConfiguration and JoglAWTApplicationConfiguration
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20150822 05:05:30 -jogamp- Continue @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20150822050530.html