JogAmp IRC Chat Logs

#jogamp @ irc.freenode.net - 20131220 05:05:34 (UTC)

20131220 05:05:34 -jogamp- Previous @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20131219050533.html
20131220 05:05:34 -jogamp- This channel is logged @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20131220050534.html
20131220 06:18:37 * xranby (~xranby@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
20131220 06:30:15 * xranby (~xranby@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 06:34:54 <sgothel> good morning
20131220 06:35:43 <[Mike]> good mornin
20131220 06:35:46 <sgothel> finding a debian config (sid, experimental) supporting amd-apu A8-4555M (trinity) HD7600G
20131220 06:36:04 <sgothel> guess this one is too new (1 year .. hmm)
20131220 06:37:08 <sgothel> 'apt-get autoremove' <- always scary :)
20131220 06:38:26 <sgothel> so it seems .. it needs 3.11 kernel, latest xorg drivers and mesa/dri 10* .. hmm
20131220 06:38:35 <[Mike]> agreed. I took out one my dev systems that way.
20131220 06:39:06 <[Mike]> lucky it was just a VM
20131220 07:39:12 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 07:53:37 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
20131220 08:12:25 * eclesia (~husky@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 08:12:33 <eclesia> good morning
20131220 08:21:13 * monsieur_max (~maxime@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 10:01:27 <xranby> good morning
20131220 11:46:07 * gouessej (546051e4@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 11:46:14 <gouessej> Hi
20131220 11:47:35 <gouessej> Does someone know whether OpenJFX will be bundled with OpenJDK 1.8?
20131220 11:57:25 <xranby> gouessej: it will not be bundled, OpenJFX is built separately
20131220 11:57:25 <xranby> it has to be installed manually
20131220 11:57:25 <xranby> into the openjdk ext folder
20131220 11:58:07 <xranby> gouessej: neugens (redhat) are about to make some redhat rpm packages that install openjfx 8 into the redhat/fedora openjdk installation
20131220 11:58:42 <gouessej> I know this is the current situation but JavaFX will be in the classpath of Oracle Java 1.8, I don't understand what is going to happen under Linux
20131220 12:00:28 <xranby> gouessej: hard to tell atm since linux distributions currently do not package openjdk and javafx
20131220 12:00:33 <xranby> 8
20131220 12:01:50 <gouessej> Ok, I'll have to ask Mageia maintainers to bundle OpenJFX with OpenJDK at least for Java 1.8
20131220 12:02:08 <gouessej> in order to discourage people from using the proprietary VM
20131220 12:02:12 <xranby> i have tested to build OpenJFX 8 using OpenJDK 8, it work
20131220 12:02:18 <gouessej> :)
20131220 12:03:25 <xranby> there is one missing media native lib that prevents media javafx applications to emmit any sound/video under linux. not sure if i have missed to add a build configuration, at least the media javafx native lib is not built by default
20131220 12:04:07 <xranby> if the Mageia run into any issues, tell them to talk with me and i may help out
20131220 12:04:10 <gouessej> Actually, it should work except for a few formats using proprietary codecs
20131220 12:04:19 <gouessej> ok thanks
20131220 12:05:37 <gouessej> I will probably have to update the user's guide concerning JavaFX / OpenJFX
20131220 12:06:01 <gouessej> some pieces of information shouldn't be only in a bug report
20131220 12:06:33 <gouessej> I plan to talk about JFXPanel / SwingNode until I have something better to provide
20131220 12:07:55 <xranby> best would be to make the whole javafx framework modular
20131220 12:07:55 <xranby> so that it can be bundled by the app that needs it
20131220 12:07:55 <xranby> instead of adding it to the ext folder
20131220 12:07:56 <xranby> similar to how you made java3d modular
20131220 12:08:37 <gouessej> ok but if it is shipped with the proprietary VM, some people will prefer installing it
20131220 12:09:33 <gouessej> The problem is that Oracle's choices have an impact
20131220 12:10:10 <gouessej> If JavaFX is already in the classpath, I can't use OpenJFX, can I?
20131220 12:12:04 <gouessej> Do you suggest to keep OpenJFX into a separate package depending on OpenJDK?
20131220 12:12:24 <gouessej> We have to clarify that before I talked to Mageia maintainers
20131220 12:12:30 <gouessej> "talk"
20131220 12:12:31 <gouessej> :s
20131220 12:15:15 <xranby> (13:11:48) gouessej: If JavaFX is already in the classpath, I can't use OpenJFX, can I? - you can specify -Djava.ext.dirs=openjfx8/build/linux-sdk/rt/lib/ext
20131220 12:15:57 <xranby> to override the ext dir for the javafx app to use the openjfx 8 built ext dir
20131220 12:16:27 <xranby> for example i use the following commandline to run the Ensemble8.jar using OpenJDK 8
20131220 12:16:56 <xranby> jdk8/build/linux-x86-normal-server-release/images/j2sdk-image/bin/java -jamvm -Djava.ext.dirs=openjfx-8-graphics-rt/build/linux-sdk/rt/lib/ext -jar ./apps/samples/Ensemble8/build/libs/Ensemble8.jar
20131220 12:18:16 <xranby> (13:10:20) gouessej: Actually, it should work except for a few formats using proprietary codecs <- openjfx 8 depend on gstreamer thus it should work if the right build option is passed to openjfx 8 grade
20131220 12:18:45 <xranby> gradle
20131220 12:19:17 <gouessej> Ok but imagine that I deploy my application with Icedtea Webstart
20131220 12:19:27 <gouessej> or Java Web Start
20131220 12:19:41 <gouessej> if JavaFX is already present, OpenJFX will be ignored
20131220 12:24:12 <xranby> i would then suggest Mageia put openjfx 8 as a dependency for the icedtea-web package in combination with openjdk 8
20131220 12:24:19 <monsieur_max> ;) http://imgur.com/gallery/UbSVe86
20131220 12:25:19 <xranby> this will solve java web start use with oracle javaws (then using oracles javafx) and icedtea-web javaws (using the system installed openjfx 8 )
20131220 12:26:04 <xranby> locally installed openjfx apps and icedtea-web javaws can use the -Djava.ext.dirs= to pick up the openjfx 8 installation
20131220 12:26:24 <xranby> monsieur_max: true :)
20131220 12:26:35 <gouessej> I try to stay far from the extension mechanism
20131220 12:27:34 <gouessej> it seems a bit weird to make an OpenJFX package depending on Icedtea-web
20131220 12:28:10 <xranby> the other way around.. make icedtea-web package depend on openjfx
20131220 12:28:27 <xranby> if you want to have a plugin and javaws that behave like oracles plugin and javaws
20131220 12:29:04 <xranby> i dont like the way oracle manage its plugin..
20131220 12:29:20 <xranby> best would be to make the plugin neutral
20131220 12:29:20 <gouessej> it seems more logical but applications not using Web start should behave the same with Oracle Java and OpenJDK
20131220 12:29:31 <xranby> and have a pluggable native window framework
20131220 12:29:39 <xranby> where awt or openjfx is optional
20131220 12:33:35 <gouessej> If we put OpenJFX into OpenJDK, it won't be really modular but it will look like what Oracle does, some developers won't use the proprietary version but if we make icedtea-web package depend on OpenJFX, some developers will complain because it won't be in the classpath by default
20131220 12:33:37 <gouessej> :(
20131220 12:34:58 <gouessej> Does java.ext.dirs allow to use OpenJFX even thoug JavaFX is available, for example under Windows, in order to use ES2 which isn't bundled by default?
20131220 12:58:32 * gouessej (546051e4@anon) Quit (Quit: Page closed)
20131220 14:00:14 * xranby (~xranby@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
20131220 14:02:24 * xranby (~xranby@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 14:47:57 <sgothel> back ..
20131220 14:48:55 <sgothel> I guess I missed the javafx show .. well
20131220 14:49:38 <sgothel> I still would like somebody to impl. the GLJPanel equivalent for javafx .. (offscreen rendering and 'javafx style compositioning') first
20131220 14:49:41 <xranby> the distros will have the final say if they want to bundle openjfx with their openjdk builds
20131220 14:49:45 <sgothel> since this would be most easy
20131220 14:50:02 <sgothel> but me not really motivated in this regard
20131220 14:50:32 <sgothel> (10:07:57 PM) xranby-64: sgothel: on my machine the applet steal all keyboard focus ... thus i cant edit the firefox url
20131220 14:50:39 <sgothel> I remember this as well .. hmm
20131220 14:51:16 <sgothel> KWin + icedtea-plugin 1.3.2-1: OK (wheezy)
20131220 14:51:25 <sgothel> i.e. I can edit URL
20131220 14:52:52 <sgothel> Unity + icedtea-plugin 1.4-3ubuntu2: Error (Ubuntu 13.10)
20131220 14:53:22 <xranby> interesting
20131220 14:53:24 <sgothel> ^^ testing w/ Kwin ..
20131220 14:53:40 <xranby> it may be the plugin as well
20131220 14:53:42 <xranby> then
20131220 14:53:45 <sgothel> (latest ff 26.0)
20131220 14:53:50 <xranby> 1.3 vs 1.4
20131220 14:54:15 <xranby> i was quite surprised that firefox allowed the plugin to steal its input
20131220 14:54:29 <eclesia> quick question : is there a way to create a newt frame which is not show in the desktop bar ?
20131220 14:54:42 <sgothel> KWin + icedtea-plugin 1.4-3ubuntu2: Error (Ubuntu 13.10)
20131220 14:54:42 <xranby> under which os?
20131220 14:54:47 <eclesia> linux
20131220 14:56:10 <xranby> have you seen other applications being able to create such windwos?
20131220 14:56:24 <eclesia> swing
20131220 14:56:38 <eclesia> the dropdown menu of a JMenu for example
20131220 14:56:51 <eclesia> JDialog too
20131220 14:58:09 <eclesia> Joptionpane, toolip ...
20131220 14:58:13 <eclesia> tooltip*
20131220 14:58:52 <sgothel> NEWT: It's the native WM's decision whether to bringup an 'icon' or not, usually one could use a 'pop up' window style/hint for asking WM to not doing so.
20131220 14:59:07 <sgothel> right now, NEWT does not support this, but good idea ..
20131220 14:59:36 <eclesia> that would be great
20131220 15:00:30 <eclesia> if the icon could be configured, I think you would have everything to replace a swing/awt frame
20131220 15:02:13 <sgothel> .. which brings us back to .. err .. icons :)
20131220 15:02:27 <eclesia> work in progress ;)
20131220 15:02:47 <eclesia> xpm, xbm done, ico and cur on the way
20131220 15:03:02 <eclesia> (for reading only, writing will take more time)
20131220 15:03:19 <sgothel> writing to memory, yes, that is what we would need
20131220 15:03:38 <sgothel> based on 'pixels', i.e. we will probably decode JPEG or PNG
20131220 15:04:01 <sgothel> into a PixelBuffer (see our API)
20131220 15:04:05 <xranby> Window state:
20131220 15:04:05 <xranby> Skip Taskbar
20131220 15:04:26 <xranby> xwininfo -wm
20131220 15:05:17 <xranby> so if the newt window adds this Skip Taskbar state then it will not show up in the desktop bar
20131220 15:05:57 <sgothel> Eclesia: Is it possible to give us a written permission to use your code (at least those files) to be used under our license? You know .. the liability thingy. Hence dual license use. I know we could in theory just use it - but having it written would be much nicer. You could do this via an extra text file, which I would check into our repo (our LICENSE.txt file)
20131220 15:06:26 <sgothel> all those nice EWMHints
20131220 15:06:40 <sgothel> we can do this for 2.2* ..
20131220 15:06:57 <sgothel> then we shall use a bitmask for all the props .. not 'boolean' values as we use them now :)
20131220 15:07:31 <eclesia> ok, I'll add a file. but I can only do it for the code I have written myself.
20131220 15:07:55 <sgothel> yes, thank you .. please denominate them w/ full path, so we can be sure
20131220 15:08:15 <sgothel> users of jogamp will be grateful, me as well
20131220 15:08:22 * eclesia (~husky@anon) has left #jogamp
20131220 15:08:27 * eclesia (~husky@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 15:08:31 <sgothel> (avoiding the legal stress ..:)
20131220 15:08:35 <monsieur_max> oh yes, icon for newt would be terrific ;)
20131220 15:08:47 <eclesia> the list will be long
20131220 15:09:04 <sgothel> for now: only the icon stuff maybe ..
20131220 15:09:25 <sgothel> but sure, you may be able to add all other files where you can grant such permission 'while you go ..'
20131220 15:09:51 <sgothel> this would be a great service for all users with those nasty legal constraints .. we know, sorry!
20131220 15:10:05 <sgothel> .. and THANK YOU
20131220 15:10:07 <eclesia> can't I just write : Any class with author Johann Sorel ?
20131220 15:10:22 <sgothel> but it should be up to you to determine that
20131220 15:10:40 <sgothel> i.e. thats why we explicitly state all external stuff in our license file
20131220 15:10:56 <sgothel> (usually by folder/package names .. which is enough if clean)
20131220 15:11:39 <sgothel> yes, this can be validated - assuming the git history is the truth .. etc etc
20131220 15:22:04 <sgothel> KWin + oracle-plugin 7u45: ERR (Ubuntu 13.10)
20131220 15:23:07 <xranby> sgothel: do you find any system when it fail?
20131220 15:23:24 <xranby> all new lugins == fail ?
20131220 15:23:27 <sgothel> if I reparent out of the browser, it works
20131220 15:23:27 <xranby> plugins
20131220 15:24:28 <sgothel> KWin + oracle-plugin 7u45: ERR (Wheezy) vs KWin + icedtea-plugin 1.3.2-1: OK (wheezy)
20131220 15:24:38 <sgothel> weird .. double checking ..
20131220 15:24:47 <sgothel> but seems to be also a WM issue
20131220 15:25:24 <sgothel> Funny, since NEWT does not 'steal' the focus, i.e. .. capture it
20131220 15:27:14 <sgothel> code snippet for an HTML input text field anybody here ? :)
20131220 15:27:33 <xranby> sgothel: when we code jweb shall we focus on letting the plugin only expose the native window handle and a jvm
20131220 15:27:56 <xranby> thus we can then attach newt to it
20131220 15:28:01 <xranby> in the app
20131220 15:28:20 <xranby> make the plugin expost the plugin interface
20131220 15:28:26 <xranby> to any java api
20131220 15:28:39 <xranby> "where to cut the chese"
20131220 15:28:42 <xranby> cheese
20131220 15:29:11 <sgothel> yes ofc ..
20131220 15:29:20 <sgothel> will use the NativeWindow API
20131220 15:30:14 <xranby> ok i will now go on holiday,.. closing down office for the weekend
20131220 15:30:19 <xranby> will be available from home ofc
20131220 15:32:57 * xranby (~xranby@anon) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
20131220 16:23:43 <sgothel> GL_RENDERER = Gallium 0.4 on AMD ARUBA
20131220 16:23:44 <sgothel> GL_VERSION = 3.0 Mesa 10.0.1
20131220 16:23:44 <sgothel> ^^ Test box setup (finally) - Debian SID + Experimental (Kernel 3.12, Mesa/DRI 10.0.1)
20131220 16:27:11 <sgothel> ^^ No ES3 w/ current code - 'good', .. adding ES3 detection workaround
20131220 16:31:38 <sgothel> @Mark: Time to reevaluate Quirk 'GLNonCompliant' :)
20131220 16:32:10 <rmk0> ah!
20131220 16:33:02 <sgothel> maybe .. but probably still no working compat-GL > 3.0 :)
20131220 16:33:19 <sgothel> so the ES3 bit is still not in there (Mesa 10.0.1)
20131220 16:33:38 <rmk0> activity on that bug on their tracker seems to have fizzled out
20131220 16:33:50 <rmk0> they asked me to compile something... i tried, failed, asked the mailing list how, nobody responded
20131220 16:34:29 <sgothel> which is weird, since w/ given knowledge they should love to fix this core EGL/driver issue
20131220 16:34:40 <sgothel> so it's not galium .. as I stated earlier
20131220 16:34:50 <sgothel> i.e. Gallium + llvm has it
20131220 16:35:35 <rmk0> problem is giving them something they can compile and run
20131220 16:36:04 <rmk0> irritating just how much code is required to open a context
20131220 16:36:09 <sgothel> not necessary .. a simple 'test the EGLConfig bits' should suffice .. and heck, they should have such a test case
20131220 16:36:25 <sgothel> yeah 'good morning' :)
20131220 16:36:29 <rmk0> lo!
20131220 16:36:42 <sgothel> most of our code is about all that ..
20131220 16:37:23 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 16:37:26 <rmk0> ... do they actually have test cases?
20131220 16:37:45 <rmk0> they've got some conformance suite called piglit, that someone mentioned in the report
20131220 16:37:50 <rmk0> but... that was the last thing anyone said
20131220 16:38:24 <sgothel> so it's not testing it ..
20131220 16:38:31 <rmk0> apparently not
20131220 16:38:34 <sgothel> maybe they should use jogamp ..
20131220 16:38:38 <rmk0> will go at them again
20131220 16:38:47 <sgothel> no kidding, I guess we cover a lot of these things :)
20131220 16:39:23 <sgothel> but would be great .. to learn adding tests to piglit .. hmm
20131220 16:39:43 <sgothel> so we would not need to blabber a lot .. just show 'em
20131220 16:40:04 <sgothel> then we can also add some shared context stress tests :)
20131220 16:40:30 <rmk0> will take a look at it
20131220 16:40:55 <rmk0> http://piglit.freedesktop.org
20131220 16:42:00 <rmk0> seems... fairly horrible
20131220 16:42:27 <rmk0> "lines that start with PIGLIT: are collected and interpreted as a Python dictionary"
20131220 16:42:33 <rmk0> what could possibly go wrong
20131220 16:42:37 <sgothel> :)
20131220 16:42:53 <sgothel> do they automate things ?
20131220 16:43:03 <sgothel> like our jenkins ?
20131220 16:43:10 <sgothel> on a matrix of cards etc ?
20131220 16:43:12 <rmk0> doesn't look like it
20131220 16:43:20 <sgothel> that explains alot
20131220 16:43:21 <rmk0> looks like people run it manually whilst working on drivers
20131220 16:43:27 <sgothel> brrrr
20131220 16:43:57 <sgothel> .. doorbell ..
20131220 16:51:29 * rmk0 clones piglit
20131220 16:57:22 * monsieur_max (~maxime@anon) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
20131220 16:58:36 * eclesia (~husky@anon) has left #jogamp
20131220 17:24:49 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
20131220 17:37:09 * [Mike] (~Mike]@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
20131220 18:18:53 <sgothel> http://people.freedesktop.org/~chadversary/waffle/ <- will be helpful for NEWT/JOGL wayland support
20131220 18:19:04 <sgothel> (a piglit dependency)
20131220 18:19:59 <sgothel> cloning piglit seems to be quite something :)
20131220 18:20:23 <sgothel> counting .. and counting .. remote objects .. huge data set ?
20131220 18:21:30 <rmk0> heh, yes
20131220 18:21:40 <rmk0> it actually failed here after 46351 objects
20131220 18:21:43 <rmk0> am recloning
20131220 18:21:49 <sgothel> 13310 ..
20131220 18:31:18 * Eclesia (~eclesia@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 18:31:25 <Eclesia> hi (again)
20131220 18:32:53 <sgothel> 16066 .. hi
20131220 18:33:02 <sgothel> 46351 done
20131220 18:35:37 <rmk0> heh, still on 15118 here
20131220 18:35:49 * rmk0 pedals faster
20131220 18:36:10 <sgothel> cloning is doing something secret still .
20131220 18:51:05 <rmk0> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
20131220 18:51:08 <rmk0> ugh
20131220 18:51:20 <rmk0> and of course, it deleted the temporary directory
20131220 18:51:23 <rmk0> thanks git
20131220 18:51:25 <sgothel> remote: Counting objects: 46351, done.
20131220 18:51:25 <sgothel> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
20131220 18:51:25 <sgothel> fatal: early EOF
20131220 18:51:25 <sgothel> fatal: index-pack failed
20131220 18:51:28 <sgothel> :(
20131220 18:51:37 <rmk0> tiresome
20131220 18:52:16 <sgothel> fascinating that resources for such a core and essential project seems to be so scarce
20131220 18:56:27 <rmk0> back later \o\
20131220 18:58:38 <Eclesia> sgothel: would that be okay ? http://pastebin.com/K6M149PK
20131220 18:59:02 <Eclesia> added as a file in the root folder of the projet
20131220 19:00:16 <sgothel> perfect .. true for all files ? if so - it's complete.
20131220 19:01:07 <sgothel> will add those license files for code pulled from you
20131220 19:03:59 <Eclesia> file added : https://bitbucket.org/Eclesia/unlicense/commits/ea16fa9df9dde2a53bef156dc001f4e8c5e13d1c
20131220 19:09:11 * Eclesia going back to his popup menu ^^
20131220 19:45:26 * monsieur_max (~maxime@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 20:43:28 <rmk0> .o.
20131220 20:47:31 * [Mike] (~Mike]@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 21:07:13 * gouessej (52794368@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 21:07:55 <gouessej> Hi again
20131220 21:08:07 <gouessej> Sven, I'm reading your replies in the logs...
20131220 21:10:34 <gouessej> I agree with you about the licensing.
20131220 21:11:24 <gouessej> Why would we need a GLJFXPanel? Just put a GLJPanel into a SwingNode, what's wrong with that?
20131220 21:15:35 <gouessej> Bye
20131220 21:15:46 * gouessej (52794368@anon) Quit (Quit: Page closed)
20131220 21:53:39 * Eclesia (~eclesia@anon) has left #jogamp
20131220 22:05:08 * hharrison (~chatzilla@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 22:06:14 <hharrison> sgothel: that cloning issue looks like a classic 'tons of loose objects OOM when creating the pack for fetchig"
20131220 22:06:36 <hharrison> Some of the jogamp repos could use a bit of maintenance
20131220 22:11:04 <hharrison> I've just been going through the repos at work doing some cleanup, I'm in that kinda mood
20131220 22:11:34 <hharrison> I'm seeing about 20MB of savings in jogl.git just doing a repack
20131220 22:19:27 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) has joined #jogamp
20131220 22:19:54 <xranby-64> sgothel: rmk0: there is a gihub mirror: git clone https://github.com/stereotype441/piglit
20131220 22:21:40 <xranby-64> that allowed me to clone piglit in less than a minute
20131220 22:38:21 * monsieur_max (~maxime@anon) has left #jogamp
20131220 23:10:32 <xranby-64> i have published a copy of the freedesktop piglit master at https://github.com/xranby/piglit
20131221 01:13:24 * xranby-64 (~familjen@anon) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
20131221 04:43:48 * [Mike] (~Mike]@anon) Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
20131221 05:05:34 -jogamp- Continue @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20131221050534.html