#jogamp @ irc.freenode.net - 20130225 05:05:53 (UTC)
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20130225 16:45:05 <odin_> know anything about libjsig.so ? does OpenGL API use unix signals ?
20130225 16:47:14 <rmk0> it doesn't
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20130225 18:59:23 <xranby_ac100> the turning point: https://blogs.oracle.com/henrik/entry/java_in_steam_store
20130225 19:00:40 <xranby_ac100> this is the first time oracle recommend use of jogamp jogl on one of their blogs
20130225 19:08:36 <sgothel> -> Days Of Wonder :)
20130225 19:09:45 <sgothel> Still - Oracle should come clear w/ License/Patents .. IMHO http://forum.jogamp.org/JOGL-JavaFX-integration-and-the-future-tp4028263p4028366.html
20130225 19:12:44 <odin_> I am not sure Oracle have the man power you'd expect
20130225 19:18:36 <sgothel> .. to make a license / patent statement ? :)
20130225 19:21:36 <sgothel> Puppy Games .. tsts, maybe Erik and Brice like to make a blog soon :)
20130225 19:22:07 <odin_> no to manage their stewardship of Java(tm)
20130225 19:22:20 <sgothel> lol
20130225 19:22:28 <odin_> brain power left right ? they hire many H1Bs in US
20130225 19:23:05 <odin_> all we need is another couple of statements of major releases where things are delayed, be is features into Java8 or JavaFX2
20130225 19:23:11 <sgothel> dude, who cares ? It's not about them to save the world, but about them to give a legally binding peace of mind using OpenJDK sources on all platforms!
20130225 19:23:27 <odin_> Red Hat will do that :)
20130225 19:23:49 <sgothel> i.e. I could care less about JFX and all that - but a safe haven for usage technology would be good
20130225 19:24:08 <sgothel> right now only Dalvik maybe a save bet on mobile
20130225 19:24:32 <odin_> what is the definition of embedded systems because all the ARMs around me at the moment are not embeded in my mine, they are as powerful as systems from not long ago
20130225 19:25:45 <sgothel> Odin: Read the details, read the 'binary license' coming w/ JDK/JRE builds etc - the patent grant .. the TCK blessing .. all this FUD. And then - source is GPL. How does this play along ? No answer from Oracle. I asked them at FOSDEM. Answer: 'I am not a lawyer ..' :)
20130225 19:26:16 <odin_> no statement is their mode of operation
20130225 19:26:25 <odin_> but IBM do a JDK as well as Red Hat
20130225 19:26:56 <sgothel> IBM left Apache's effort and like Red Hat doing the Oracle dance
20130225 19:27:16 <odin_> are you from the USA ? since patents are not a huge a concern for EU
20130225 19:29:46 <sgothel> I lived & worked there .. now EU, however, you product has no chance if you don't bend over to the overlords :)
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20130225 19:30:46 <xranby_ac100> btw: oracle is working on reducing the testing needed for a build to pass the TCK: http://openjdk.java.net/jeps/161 "The TCK’s test agent must not require the use of any APIs outside of the compact1 Profile."
20130225 19:31:00 <odin_> for compact profile right ?
20130225 19:31:14 <odin_> I think there should be more testing not less for full-uber profile
20130225 19:31:40 <xranby_ac100> there is more testing like all the unittests outside the TCK
20130225 19:31:45 <xranby_ac100> that is run for each build
20130225 19:32:04 <xranby_ac100> the TCK is what keeps lawyers happ
20130225 19:32:07 <xranby_ac100> y
20130225 19:32:22 <xranby_ac100> its the secret test that you have to pass in order to get oracle patent protection
20130225 19:32:31 <xranby_ac100> and if this test is reduced then its a big win
20130225 19:32:43 <odin_> but RH will pay and do all that
20130225 19:33:05 <xranby_ac100> odin_: remember redhat can only test their builds
20130225 19:33:19 <xranby_ac100> you dont get the same protection by using the same sourcecode compared to redhat
20130225 19:33:42 <odin_> you are a library, it is not your responsibility to ensure the user of the library is running on a licensed JDK for their situation
20130225 19:33:44 <xranby_ac100> of course your buid may pass the test, but you still need to do the test
20130225 19:33:58 <odin_> they might be located in the middle-east and therefore they can not get a licensed JDK at all
20130225 19:35:22 <xranby_ac100> yes, a work to ease this situation are welcome
20130225 19:35:49 <sgothel> well, I can't consider tech free (three freedoms) .. if I need another party to run some tests and certify it .. at their grace & willingness. Similar to the UEFI GNU/Linux kernel signing. It simply sucks.
20130225 19:36:15 <odin_> sure but it has always been this way for Java/JDK
20130225 19:36:29 <odin_> of course feel free to push it but.. I don't see it related to JOGL project itself
20130225 19:36:39 <sgothel> This still has to be seen, i.e. merits of that Oracle TCK claim - see Google
20130225 19:37:06 <sgothel> right, this discussion is not directly related, just mentioning it as a reply :)
20130225 19:37:26 <odin_> now a technique for implementing text rendering that maybe implemented in JOGL might have direct patent concerns
20130225 19:37:49 <sgothel> well, good news - ours is _FREE_
20130225 19:37:49 <odin_> however I would bet that most open source project over a certain size breach some patent somewhere that the author is not aware of
20130225 19:38:08 <odin_> so until the parent holder makes the author aware... I would not worry about it
20130225 19:38:14 <odin_> s/parent/patent/
20130225 19:38:29 <odin_> it only because a problem that needs action at that point in time
20130225 19:38:48 <sgothel> pls don't make such statements here about our Graph IP, since graph is developed by Rami Santina (see his paper) and granted for free!
20130225 19:38:58 <sgothel> He and I have implemented it
20130225 19:39:02 <odin_> what is the claim I am making ?
20130225 19:39:23 <sgothel> putting our text rendering license in an uncertain state :)
20130225 19:39:29 <odin_> and you may still have violated a petent
20130225 19:39:44 <odin_> *patent, you just side-stepped the one you were looking at and aware of at the time
20130225 19:39:55 <odin_> but some other will exist
20130225 19:39:57 <sgothel> bullshit
20130225 19:40:13 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/doc/gpunurbs2011/p70-santina.pdf
20130225 19:40:30 <sgothel> You can look at any related patent .. and you should.
20130225 19:40:38 <odin_> people have patents for rendering text to a screen
20130225 19:40:51 <sgothel> A patent is breached if all it's claims are touched
20130225 19:41:04 <odin_> let alone some mathematical process to put it on an arbitrary 3d surface
20130225 19:41:12 <sgothel> usually, especially in computer related patents .. they are very detailed
20130225 19:41:52 <sgothel> we us a diff. method than Loop/Blinn, and this is reviewed in mentioned paper above
20130225 19:42:17 <sgothel> you cannot patent such a math .. :)
20130225 19:42:31 <sgothel> not even in the US, only as an application e.g. w/ GPU .. -> detailed
20130225 19:42:51 <odin_> I am not making any claim about JOGL but that one or more patents will be breached by most open source project over a certain size
20130225 19:43:26 <sgothel> well, I would say I won't sign a contract where I will indemnify a user of JOGL for patent claims :)
20130225 19:43:48 <sgothel> don't we all hate patents ? ok .. back to work :)
20130225 19:43:51 <odin_> people have patents for rendering text to a screen, like I have a 7 segment LED or a set of bulbs that can indicate a number
20130225 19:45:27 <[Mike]> :\
20130225 19:46:57 <[Mike]> sgothel: nice paper, a pretty good read.
20130225 19:47:51 <sgothel> Thanks to Rami, he got something there. We discussed our previous attempts to apply Loop/Blinn .. which were all failures. This one actually works, not just for fonts.
20130225 19:49:06 <sgothel> Reality sucks a bit - we still need to make the curve processing more performant for fonts etc. No time yet .. well, but it's on the TODO list - see our graph UI demo applet.
20130225 19:53:16 <juank_prada> is it possible to use Jogls GlCanvas or GLWindow in a JinternalFrame? along with JDesktopPane?
20130225 19:53:58 <sgothel> GLWindow via NewtCanvasAWT - However both are subject to lw/hw mixing restrictions
20130225 19:54:16 <sgothel> lw lightweight - hw heavyweight
20130225 19:54:40 <sgothel> aka .. your mileage may vary, some have success w/ it though
20130225 19:55:06 <sgothel> as long the area is opaque not occluded by some swing stuff .. should be fine
20130225 19:55:18 <sgothel> otherwise, you may need to use GLJPanel
20130225 20:01:43 <juank_prada> sgothel, got it, thanks
20130225 21:04:49 <xranby_ac100> sgothel: some days ago, Matt Hall from ULC http://cmic.cs.ucl.ac.uk/ Microstructure Imaging Group http://cmic.cs.ucl.ac.uk/mig/index.php demonstrated how to perform MRI image analysis on a raspberry pi: http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/3334 to my surprise all their algorithms was still CPU so i informed them that there do exist GPU solutions.
20130225 21:12:13 <sgothel> that would be interesting .. solid body rendering ..
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20130225 21:48:23 <juank_prada> HI guys, I have this GLCanvas set as a left component in a JSplitPane, but everytime I try to move the JSplitPane's devider, I get an exception saying: java.lang.RuntimeException: javax.media.opengl.GLException: Unable to create temp OpenGL context for device context 0xb013cd3
20130225 21:49:17 <juank_prada> any idea why I am getting that exception?
20130225 21:50:10 <juank_prada> resizing the applcation main frame does not throw such exception, so I think it might be related to the SplitPane
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20130226 00:20:44 <Slash_Fury> Hey guys, how can I get the projection matrix in JOGL? Trying to grab it to use in my shader
20130226 00:21:24 <Slash_Fury> if it affects it at all, I'm doing orthogonal rendering.
20130226 00:43:40 <Slash_Fury> Ah, I'm getting it by using glGetFloatv; is there a better way, or is this it?
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